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Post by The Zeebzob on Apr 14, 2017 14:01:19 GMT -5
I really don't think wear would be a huge concern, unless the parts were really soft, or if you planned to do tens of thousands of wheels.
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Post by Vitamin K on Apr 14, 2017 14:18:21 GMT -5
I really don't think wear would be a huge concern, unless the parts were really soft, or if you planned to do tens of thousands of wheels.  |
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Post by micro on Apr 14, 2017 14:50:45 GMT -5
The tolerance of the bushing inner diameter is +.0001 to +.0005 The tolerance of the pin gauge is .0001. I would guess a machined rod and end would be off more than that. You would need to figure out how accurate you want and how much you are willing to pay for someone to make said parts. 1 inch bushings are 9.31 to 4.47 a piece depending on how many you want to get at a time.
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Post by micro on Apr 14, 2017 14:54:19 GMT -5
Just remember that a 3/16 rod turned down taken out of a collet and place back in is no longer as accurate as it was made when it was machined and left in the collet. It seems like trying to go up stream without a paddle.
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Post by Vitamin K on Apr 14, 2017 16:44:50 GMT -5
Just remember that a 3/16 rod turned down taken out of a collet and place back in is no longer as accurate as it was made when it was machined and left in the collet. It seems like trying to go up stream without a paddle. Just call me Mr. Salmon...  |
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Post by lostaussie on Apr 14, 2017 22:56:52 GMT -5
Can't you but some kind of power control that the press would plug into to slow it down that way? Electrical stuff is not my strong point. The proxxon uses a simple belt system so I guess it could be driven off a slower external motor what would be max RPMs you would want. Why not use a drill bushing say 3/16 inner DIA. Then turn down an end of stock that is precision ground that fits into the bushing with the end ground machined down to the DIA of the bore and again use a normal drill to spin the stock in the drill bushing. That could be made fairly cheap and would be easy enough to make many different size pins to hold the wheel. Then just find a way to clamp a HSS bit as the cutter and make it adjust somehow. This would improve on the DW tool quite a bit. To get it snug enough so wheel would not turn would you not damage bore. Or is it just like qtip snug that would be enough as you are doing small cuts with each pass. These ideas look promising obviously the closer to the bushing you can keep the wheel the better. How expensive to get machining done on 3/8 drill stock. |
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Post by Professor Moriarty on Apr 14, 2017 23:49:15 GMT -5
Can't you but some kind of power control that the press would plug into to slow it down that way? Electrical stuff is not my strong point. Why not use a drill bushing say 3/16 inner DIA. Then turn down an end of stock that is precision ground that fits into the bushing with the end ground machined down to the DIA of the bore and again use a normal drill to spin the stock in the drill bushing. That could be made fairly cheap and would be easy enough to make many different size pins to hold the wheel. Then just find a way to clamp a HSS bit as the cutter and make it adjust somehow. This would improve on the DW tool quite a bit. To get it snug enough so wheel would not turn would you not damage bore. Or is it just like qtip snug that would be enough as you are doing small cuts with each pass. These ideas look promising obviously the closer to the bushing you can keep the wheel the better. How expensive to get machining done on 3/8 drill stock. Funny lostaussie ... I was also thinking about a belt driven system for turning the pin... These guys here are being coy about the tip of the pin, but I think that it is a somewhat closely guarded secret... and fellas got ticked when I guessed it and blabbed it out on the Zeeb forum at the moment of realization. LOL!! Soooooo... PM me for more details if curious. |
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Post by Professor Moriarty on Apr 14, 2017 23:55:53 GMT -5
Just remember that a 3/16 rod turned down taken out of a collet and place back in is no longer as accurate as it was made when it was machined and left in the collet. It seems like trying to go up stream without a paddle. Ok... I find this riddle to be unbelievably daunting VK... and if it were not for MicroBrush... demonstrating how a dentist could make the finest drill jig around... I would just give up... but... well... I believe that we could probably do it... The moving parts make it infinitely more complex though. I mean... even if it is spinning true... How does the blade move over the wheel? ( I have my doubts about the suggested method of the wheel moving over the blade) This cutter needs to be held very rigid, and able to move in very small increments in the X and Y axis. Is there a mini XY table that fits the budget? |
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Post by micro on Apr 15, 2017 8:25:14 GMT -5
As I've said before...Where there is a will there is a way....I'm just not full in on the will part yet. If I get bored I may think more about it. I do like the thought of some mechanism to slowly move the wheel forward in the bushing. I think keeping the cutter rigid is the easiest and cheapest. I can think of a way to move it the way I would like cheaply. I was hoping to place the bushing in my tailstock to play around and see how it would cut using the same cutter I would normally use, but it was just a micron to big.
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Post by Vitamin K on Apr 15, 2017 9:01:05 GMT -5
As I've said before...Where there is a will there is a way....I'm just not full in on the will part yet. If I get bored I may think more about it. I do like the thought of some mechanism to slowly move the wheel forward in the bushing. I think keeping the cutter rigid is the easiest and cheapest. I can think of a way to move it the way I would like cheaply. I was hoping to place the bushing in my tailstock to play around and see how it would cut using the same cutter I would normally use, but it was just a micron to big. If a cutter could be set parallel to the wheel bore, I think the wheel could remain stationary while the cutter was able to travel freely up and down the length of the tread on some kind of slide. If we could use an adjustment screw to progressively adjust the depth of the cut, I think the actual movement of the cutter could be done by hand, along the length of the spinning wheel tread. |
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Post by lostaussie on Apr 15, 2017 20:31:52 GMT -5
Just remember that a 3/16 rod turned down taken out of a collet and place back in is no longer as accurate as it was made when it was machined and left in the collet. It seems like trying to go up stream without a paddle. I am a little surprised that removing and readding to collet would affect the play. Either the rod fits in the collet with no play or there is play all along which would make it useless. If it is rotating in collet just can't see how removing and readding would have this affect. On a lathe this is an issue as the chuck will grip slightly different every time hence reason to machine the mandrel on the fly each time. I am sure there is a simple logical explanation just don't know what it is. |
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Post by Professor Moriarty on Apr 15, 2017 21:30:44 GMT -5
He is talking about a very small number Lostaussie...
I think what he was trying to say is:
Once you remove the trued up rod from the collet and put it into our new machine... that small number is likely to increase.
In other words... People usually use the lathe to turn the soft wheels because they first use the lathe to make the aluminum tool to turn the wheels...
This is as true as it gets... once you move the tool at all... it suddenly becomes a copy of a copy... a little fuzzier than the original.
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Post by Professor Moriarty on Apr 15, 2017 21:54:37 GMT -5
Hold on!!! That gives me an idea...
but... we still need some type of XY table to hold the cutter.
If the wheel is moving then we are back to square one.
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Post by lostaussie on Apr 15, 2017 22:17:23 GMT -5
He is talking about a very small number Lostaussie... I think what he was trying to say is: Once you remove the trued up rod from the collet and put it into our new machine... that small number is likely to increase. In other words... People usually use the lathe to turn the soft wheels because they first use the lathe to make the aluminum tool to turn the wheels... This is as true as it gets... once you move the tool at all... it suddenly becomes a copy of a copy... a little fuzzier than the original. So I get all this and it is very true for a lathe where each time you attach the mandrel it may not be centered the same so you should just turn a new one each time. Maybe I a messing up my terms. Was thinking when Mb used term collet he was referring to the drill bushing that rod goes through. Now I see it may be drill collet or chuck. Thought the purpose of the bushing was to eliminate issues of a high run out drill or a chuck. I would think that rod and drill bushing either provide acceptable run out when paired or would not. |
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Post by Professor Moriarty on Apr 15, 2017 22:25:44 GMT -5
Dang... I can't even remember what I was thinking about... but that sounds right to me.
Yeah! What the hell was I posting?
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